Stop Online Piracy Act (http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c112:H.R.3261:) or Sons of the PATRIOTs ACT
I would assume at least a few of you have heard of this bill, as it has generated quite the shitstorm on the internet. It would seem there is a media blackout on the bill as only a few mainstream sources have bothered to address it at all. So, for that reason, I would assume there are just as many of you who haven't heard of it. Anyway, I had no intention of stirring up any kind of drama - whether it be fevered panic or intense debate. I mostly wanted to throw a bit of information out that I thought everyone here should know. I want to preface it by saying I know we all have different views on piracy and how it affects the entertainment industry, but the importance of this bill extends beyond that. It's not simply about whether piracy is right or wrong because this bill is about more than piracy - it's about free speech. It's also about how far we are willing to accept the legal reach of the United States. There's a great deal of vagueness about the wording of this bill and how far its influence does extend. That's why it is so divisive. That's why along with internet giants like Google, Facebook, and Twitter, even Microsoft (http://news.cnet.com/8301-31921_3-57330078-281/surprise-microsoft-quietly-opposes-sopa-copyright-bill/) has problems with SOPA. So this has essentially become another case of Hollywood vs the Internet - a group of people passing legislation on something of which they haven't even bothered to attain an understanding.
The problem with SOPA in its current form is that it intends to censor the internet in order to "protect" copyright, but by doing so, also allows for the quelling of free speech in regards to copyright owners. Fair use would mean even less than it currently does. In a nutshell, it's a more restrictive version of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act.
The good news is, due to all the hard-to-dismiss opposition of the current version of the bill, Congress has decided to postpone any voting on the bill until after their winter recess. In the meantime, certain crafty nerds have been coming up with ways to bypass any "protections" that may be brought on by SOPA. I wouldn't be surprised if more articles like these get proliferated on social networks like Facebook, so I thought I'd go ahead and post my own link here (http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2011/12/21/sopa-haters-are-already-finding-easy-ways-to-circumvent-its-censorship/), and offer a fair word of warning as well. While what these people are proposing isn't really that advanced (indeed, it would appear the authors of SOPA know little to nothing of how the internet works and what the most appropriate way to censor it would be), if you trust the wrong person's information, if you accept help blindly from someone without any knowledge of what you're doing - things could end very, very badly. Please do be careful when tinkering with your DNS as you could easily wind up being spoofed, and that could really open your computer up for some serious problems. That is all.
What most people don't know, and you accurately point out at the end, is that SOPA will break the internet. It will require ISPs to redirect traffic away from certain websites to some sort of SOPA page, which again as you said opens up the opportunity for unscrupulous individuals to hijack it for their own devious means.
Thankfully, if this is passed, it will not affect me personally. But I oppose it nonetheless purely because it's an attempt to shackle and monitor something that is supposedly legally protected as being free and open. Neither Hollywood, nor your government understands how badly this could fuck up the internet. And I thought those who represented the people were supposed to be knowledgeable about the subjects they debated and not rely on others to argue the other side for them...
I'm actually the one who posted at OSC first about SOPA, about a month or so back when news first broke of it ...
This is one of the most terrifying things I've ever heard. Even if it doesn't pass, the mere fact that something like this is being CONSIDERED is too much.
Quote from: Red-Machine on December 21, 2011, 04:08:34 PMAnd I thought those who represented the people were supposed to be knowledgeable about the subjects they debated and not rely on others to argue the other side for them...
They're
supposed to be, but they aren't. The only thing our representatives are knowledgeable about is prostrating themselves before special interest groups and corporations.
It's times like this I'm most grateful for being British. Our politicians actually research their shit.
Quote from: Red-Machine on December 21, 2011, 04:08:34 PM
Thankfully, if this is passed, it will not affect me personally.
Yes it will.
As stuck up as all of you are, this will still affect everyone equally.
Well, any feeling that this may not affect you, Red, is unwarranted. As I stated earlier in my post, the bill is far-reaching, and even if the bill didn't directly address how American IP is handled internationally, there would undoubtedly be a powerful ripple effect worldwide. Keep in mind, I'm not saying that out of some prideful jingoistic notion that America is at the center of everything. I'm simply stating it as fact because in this case, it's very, very true.
If you don't believe that SOPA will indeed have an international impact, read the text of the bill I linked earlier, or this (http://www.macworld.co.uk/digitallifestyle/news/?newsid=3319621).
What I'm most afraid of about this is not what the U.S. government will be able to do, but what the Internet, and specifically Anonymous, will do if this passes.
This bill may as well mark the first time since WWII that the U.S. has declared war via Congress...
Quote from: Krizonar on December 21, 2011, 05:13:21 PM
Quote from: Red-Machine on December 21, 2011, 04:08:34 PM
Thankfully, if this is passed, it will not affect me personally.
Yes it will.
As stuck up as all of you are, this will still affect everyone equally.
It only applies to US citizens. If a SOPA-weilding corporate decides to block piratebay, I will still have access to it. If congress tried to apply one of their own laws to the entire world, there would be a political shitstorm.
Quote from: Red-Machine on December 21, 2011, 06:44:08 PM
It only applies to US citizens.
What about all the US-hosted or based websites that could potentially die off if SOPA gets passed? YouTube, Facebook, Tumblr, dA, Wikipedia, possibly even Google, even if SOPA is only enforced in the US you can't say you won't be affected by it.
Quote from: Bella on December 21, 2011, 06:50:46 PM
Quote from: Red-Machine on December 21, 2011, 06:44:08 PM
It only applies to US citizens.
What about all the US-hosted or based websites that could potentially die off if SOPA gets passed? YouTube, Facebook, Tumblr, dA, Wikipedia, possibly even Google, even if SOPA is only enforced in the US you can't say you won't be affected by it.
You mean these sites are based in the U.S. and if they go down there, they're blocked everywhere on Earth because they simply don't exist anymore? pure blasphemy.
I wasn't talking about those sites being blocked, I'm talking about those sites being shut down by the people who own/manage them because of copyright issues and the threat of legal action.
Quote from: Alex S on December 21, 2011, 06:25:15 PM
What I'm most afraid of about this is not what the U.S. government will be able to do, but what the Internet, and specifically Anonymous, will do if this passes.
This bill may as well mark the first time since WWII that the U.S. has declared war via Congress...
I have absolutely no remorse for what may happen to Congress or the US Government if this passes. Pardon if I go biblical for a moment, but you reap what you sow, and Congress has been sowing for a
pride-obliterating bitch slap for quite some time.
Quote from: Bella on December 21, 2011, 07:07:39 PM
I wasn't talking about those sites being blocked, I'm talking about those sites being shut down by the people who own/manage them because of copyright issues and the threat of legal action.
I guess my wording wasn't clear then, because that's what I meant too.
If there are no youtube servers, doesn't matter where you are, there's no youtube.
dark days indeed. maybe it's just the situation in society in general weighing over right now, but to me this almost feels like the calm before the storm. like europe in the 30's, where everyone knew something bad was coming, and they knew what and who, but not much on what to do about it. i can feel a dark cloud coming over my vision, perhaps in response to the public's clouding of minds and the government's clouding of thought.
that said, if the day ever did come that i had to ask someone for help in accessing the internet, i'd trust you guys to help me think of a solution.
the only silver lining to this is that while the US doesn't realize the value of something till it's gone, they will fight tooth and nail to get it back once it is. :\
As the progenitor calls. The world is certainly in need for a nice storm of chaos to stir things up...
The balance has been kept for too long.
Really, I feel SOPA is one of the stupidest things that has ever been considered. The lingering threat of having everything I hold dear on the internet be ripped away from me is not very comforting in the least bit.
Stupid
Overbearing
Parents
Association
Nihil novi sub sole.
Not the first time a bill like this has been passed, and it most likely won't be the last. That's not to say it is something to be readily dismissed, but it's not that new. The PROTECT IP Act was a bill with very similar aims to SOPA but with a narrower reach that had been proposed before the introduction of SOPA. Before that, Congress attempted to pass COICA, the predecessor to the PROTECT IP Act, just last year. Of course, before all of this was the DMCA, with which I'm sure we're all familiar. Despite all the failures so far, SOPA is something that should be taken seriously (but not to the point of reckless panic) because it's apparent Hollywood will keeping throwing money at our elected officials until they get what they want. Let's not forget that we've got an election year coming up, and these people are doing everything they can so they can afford to bombard us with inane political ads until after the political season is over.
Fun fact: SOPA means sweep, or loser, in swedish.
@nej: gotta love how things like that sync up. :3
@IDK: yeah, anyone with enough money can get what they want.
and i'm not familiar with DMCA. :\
DMCA - Digital Millennium Copyright Act (http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c105:6:./temp/~c105xTAhF0::)
It's an amendment to the Copyright Act of 1976 (http://www.copyright.gov/title17/) (the one that pretty much affirmed the idea of fair use), and is responsible for stuff like the copy protection you see on disc-based media today. The intent of the bill was to level the playing field and allow the music and film industry a chance to prevent piracy of their work (the reason why these bills are presented so often is that lawmakers have no real notion of what the next generation of technology will hold, and thus, no real knowledge of how to protect content in the next generation). The problem is, the DMCA is already abused thoroughly enough as is. To give you an example, the old owner of ED tried to use it to get the new ED shut down when she started Oh!Internet. I don't so much have a problem with the bills themselves as I do the wide field they permit for misuse. They tend to be very poorly worded either intentionally or from straight up bureaucratic incompetence and wind up causing more harm than good. I understand the need for copyright owners to protect their intellectual property, but it shouldn't come at the cost of intellectual innovation or consumers' rights.
what i see here is less protection of copyright laws and more a copy of china's green dam. people shouldn't rely on the government to inforce their morals. :\
It's not so much an enforcement of morals as it is legal protection of property. Would you also say the same about laws regarding theft?
I just want to be clear that I'm not promoting a libertarian cause (even though it's damn close) - I just think the people who write these laws should know more about what the hell they're doing before they do it. As it stands now, the only guide they have for writing legislation is money, which doesn't present a very balanced system for the rule of law.
Interestingly appropriate post count
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i agree with you. people shouldn't sign stuff without knowing what it says, that's how people get into bad cell phone contracts and piss-poor civil settlements.
however, i also think that this is likely going to be adapted by the more right-wing lawmakers to make a more "american" environment. whatever they mean by that is up for debate. :\
I feel compelled to point this out, but this isn't about left or right wing politics.
Much like the NDAAFY2012, the support for this bill is bi-partisan, as is the opposition. This should go to show you that there is more at work than simple political agendas. It's about money. The citizens voicing opposition to this bill come from all backgrounds too. This is one of the few issues that is really, truly polarizing. So much so that it's even brought together seemingly diametrically-opposed groups like the Tea Party and the OWS Movement. This isn't a time for political backbiting and finger-pointing because if this bill passes, we all lose.
well, yes. i wasn't citing the right wing specifically, i was just saying that people who want a more "christian" america might try to co-opt this bill to their own agenda. guess i worded it wrong. :\
that said, it's obvious that we're all gonna lose with this one. ><;;
IDK's right, there's absolutely no religious, nor right- or left-wing political motives behind SOPA, it's all about money... likewise, the opposition encompasses far left and right people and everyone in between, for the obvious threat it poses to everyone's liberty.
I don't think anyone plans to co-opt this bill into any sort of agenda, unless that agenda you speak of is bowing to pressure from the unbelievably corrupt and money-hungry entertainment industry. Though the incredibly slipshod manner in which they plan to "stop" piracy is quite suspicious, and I have wondered if it might not be a ploy to silence political subversion in the future...
eh, i'm just expecting the country to get some sort of version of green dam in the future, disguised as something less......censor-y.
i should also stop posting about politics when i'm tired. makes my arguement rather incoherent. ><;
You know, the comparison to Green Dam remind me of a pic I uploaded to the gallery a while back involving Green Dam Girl, which sums up the invasion of privacy quite well (http://ostan-collections.net/imeeji/albums/userpics/12693/green_dam_girl_with_xp.jpg)
I hope it doesn't end up being like that...
with government intrusion, it always does. ><;
I don't think the fed is really that interested in our personal information, daily routine, or other such information. I am, however, concerned about the potentiality for this bill to be abused by those in power. Right now, the greatest hurdle for any movement to get over is the mainstream media - if a group doesn't get coverage they, for most part, don't exist. Now imagine if those same groups couldn't even organize online? That would effectively kill off any true populist movement - the only people who could organize would be those capable of bypassing government blackouts, who honestly aren't that numerous.
which would effectively bring the internet back to the early 90's: something only nerds have. :\
EDIT: in searching for anime watches on ebay (the time telling kind), i encountered this:
"In response to a complaint we received under the US Digital Millennium Copyright Act, we have removed 1 result(s) from this page. If you wish, you may read the DMCA complaint that caused the removal(s) at ChillingEffects.org."
i've never encountered this before.....maybe it has something to do with the political climate now? :\
Actually, Google's been doing that awhile now. I think it started a couple of years ago, somewhere around the same time they added the "DMCA complaint" button youtube. Their whole reasoning for doing it was so they could show copyright owners they were actively involved in policing themselves. So it was actually an attempt at keeping us from reaching this point.
still, it seems odd that i would never encounter this till now. :\ and i imagine that SOPA and the attitude surrounding it is likely going to have some effect on company policies. :\
Josie was looking through her bookmarks at some old youtube links lately and noticed a number of them were down. Some of them were pulled due to DMCA, but an overwhelming majority were pulled down by the user or the user had left altogether. I can't really say whether this has something to do with fears over SOPA or not, but it is fairly telling of the time we live in. I have to wonder if we're going to be seeing any more new music getting posted on youtube. It's sad really, as youtube was probably the easiest way for me to introduce people to whatever music I was listening, as well as try music other people wanted me to hear. Even with record labels and musicians posting music videos on youtube it's a problem because those aren't always available internationally. Certainly this isn't a huge deal, mostly an inconvenience, but it is a small part of a much larger thing that is going to change how we all use the internet.
Depending on how old some of those bookmarks where, they could have been stuff deleted during the whole Viacom scare about a year or two ago
ugh, don't remind me of that. ><;;
i can only hope that the youtube to mp3 converter sites stay active, since then even if a particular video wasn't available in a particular country, one could download the video into mp3 format and then send it to whoever wants it. :\
Just use DamnVid (http://code.google.com/p/damnvid/), Kari-chan. If you have a flash drive, you can run it portably (http://portableapps.com/apps/internet/damnvid_portable) as well (since I know you're not using your own comp right now). It's also very simple to use. To sum things up, it simply sucks less.
All that being said, I'm not even sure if "official" vids are even downloadable since they use special protocols and streaming methods.
funny thing is, i managed to use DVDVideoSoft's converter to download anime from Funimation's Channel---twice. (the first time i accidentally downloaded just the audio, not video with audio. xD)
i think it goes to show that there's loopholes in everything.
Guys, seriously. The US needs to stay the fuck out of other soverign states' business. Spain has just passed a SOPA-style law and Wikileaks has revealed documents showing that your government forced them into it with the threat of sanctions and trade embargoes.
http://torrentfreak.com/us-threatened-to-blacklist-spain-for-not-implementing-site-blocking-law-120105/
Good fucking job...
so i'm considering moving to canada. :\
Count me in, Kari
either that or europe. canada's still a bit close to the dumbass, heavy-handed self-righteous ball of jesus-freak-pricks we call the US of A. :\
True. Besides, if Europe, we'd be on the same continent as the man, the myth, the Nejin >:3
Quote from: PentiumMMX on January 06, 2012, 10:43:32 AM
True. Besides, if Europe, we'd be on the same continent as the man, the myth, the Nejin >:3
Don't feed the demon.
i have family in sweden anyway. :3
Quote from: Red-Machine on January 06, 2012, 04:58:30 AM
Guys, seriously. The US needs to stay the fuck out of other soverign states' business. Spain has just passed a SOPA-style law and Wikileaks has revealed documents showing that your government forced them into it with the threat of sanctions and trade embargoes.
http://torrentfreak.com/us-threatened-to-blacklist-spain-for-not-implementing-site-blocking-law-120105/
Good fucking job...
FOR FUCK'S SAKE, STOP FUCKING BLAMING THE AMERICAN CITIZENS FOR THE ASSFUCKERY OF OUR GOVERNMENT. IT SHOWS YOU HAVE NO IDEA HOW OUR POLITICAL SYSTEM WORKS (OR DOESN'T WORK).
Our elected officials have absolutely no ambition to help their constituents, all they care about is lining their pockets with money and getting ahead in politics. They're liars too - promising the world to their voters during elections and proceeding to metaphorically screw them over with rusty farm implements once they get into office. They care nothing about serving American citizens, they're all in the pocket of corporate special interests groups, and this is why congress has something like a 7% approval rating at the moment.
Also, the last I fucking checked that SOPA-style law was passed in
Europe, not the US. Spain is a sovereign government that could have told the US government to metaphorically Shove it up their ass, if the Spanish government want to bow to US pressure their own god-damned fucktardery is to blame.
Quote from: Bella on January 06, 2012, 10:54:03 AM
FOR FUCK'S SAKE, STOP FUCKING BLAMING THE AMERICAN CITIZENS FOR THE ASSFUCKERY OF OUR GOVERNMENT. IT SHOWS YOU HAVE NO IDEA HOW OUR POLITICAL SYSTEM WORKS (OR DOESN'T WORK).
I AM NOT.I'm perfectly aware of how your political system works. When I say "The US" this or "The US" that, I am ALMOST ALWAYS referring to the US government.
My point was, the US government should not be trying to influence or threaten another soverign state into passing a domestic law that suits its interests. That's not how you do things. Period.
That's a relief, thanks for clarifying.
Also, it drives me fucking insane hearing this "LET'S ALL MOVE TO SWEDEN/CANADA/UGANDA/MYANMAR/>INSERT OTHER COUNTRY HERE< IF SOPA PASSES!!!!!!!" shit, since it implies that OTHER places in the world won't be quick to adopt these SOPA-style laws if the US and/or Europe does it first. Seriously, there's going to be NO place on earth unaffected if this shit gets passed, which is why it's so vital that it DOESN'T.
The US government wouldn't dare pull that kind of shit on us, we're too important to their agenda and too politically powerful in the UN and EU. If I was Prime Minister and they came to me with a demand like that, I'd expel the ambassador from the country in disgust.
i think this topic should be closed.
SOPA sucks ass. all in favour?
Aye
*gets out radio, says something in code about a "lock"*
>.> WTF guys?
If this isn't clear enough evidence why a debate thread/sub-forum should never be a part of this forum, I don't know what is.
In any case, I think we can all agree that SOPA is not something we want. It doesn't matter what country such a bill exists in, it's an affront to freedom everywhere. The very essence of the bill is far-reaching and oppressive, which means that every person who uses the internet has an equal opportunity to have good old righteous corporatism reaming their joy-loving asses. The point is, we can all do our part to try and prevent this bill from passing by doing more than just whining, finger-pointing, and name-calling. We can try and stay informed, then do our due diligence to make sure everyone we know is also informed - talk to people who can actually get things done. The mainstream media isn't going to say anything about this bill because the people who own the major networks either directly support SOPA or either stand to benefit from its passage in some way. That's why word of mouth is so essential here. I suppose that's all I have left to say, so hopefully I can get this all in before the thread is closed. :/
A decent closing statement from IDK.